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Mike Kotecki, an engineer by education, served as a senior executive in the supply chain industry for several decades with HK Systems and Dematic. There, he led others in the areas of engineering, sales, service, and operations. After graduating from that career, he formed MK Tactical Leadership LLC, where he contributes to various boards, consults, and educates. He recently published a book called Leadership for Engineers: How to Turn Perfectly Good STEM Professionals into Management. It is available on Amazon.
David Maloney, Editorial Director, DC Velocity 00:01
Turning engineers into managers. Warehouse yards go digital. And potential roadblocks for electric vehicles. Pull up a chair and join us as the editors of DC Velocity discuss these stories, as well as news and supply chain trends, on this week's Logistics Matters podcast.
Hi, I'm Dave Maloney. I'm the group editorial director at DC Velocity. Welcome.
Logistics Matters is sponsored by PERC, the Propane Education and Research Council. Propane is the safe, reliable energy for material handling. Propane-powered forklifts can improve air quality inside your facilities for a healthier, more productive workforce. See how propane can give your productivity a boost at propane.com/forklifts.
As usual, our DC Velocity senior editors Ben Ames and Victoria Kickham will be along to provide their insights into the top stories of this week. But to begin today: many of the key people in our industry are engineers, and many of them aspire to be leaders. How do you take someone with an engineering background and equip them with the skills to manage others? To find out, we welcome our good friend Mike Kotecki, who has just authored a book titled Leadership for Engineers: How to Turn Perfectly Good STEM Professionals Into Management.
Welcome, Mike, good to have you with us on Logistics Matters.
Mike Kotecki, Consultant, MK Tactical Leadership 01:32
Hello, I'm proud to be here.
David Maloney, Editorial Director, DC Velocity 01:34
Mike, many people may know you from the time when you, before you retired, when you were with HK Systems and then later at Dematic. Besides writing this book, what are you up to these days?
Mike Kotecki, Consultant, MK Tactical Leadership 01:45
Well, I graduated from that rewarding career a few years back and currently spend a lot of my time with friends and family, which was my objective. I used to be, I also used to be platinum on Delta Airlines. My goal was to be silver. So, I'm doing some selfish things, but I'm also on some boards. I'm on about five different boards in manufacturing companies and education and the like, so even there's no — and by the way, I just finished the book.
David Maloney, Editorial Director, DC Velocity 02:12
Right, and that's what we're here to talk about today. Your book was developed to help engineers and STEM professionals make the transition into leadership roles. Mike, why do you believe that those folks are strong candidates for management?
Mike Kotecki, Consultant, MK Tactical Leadership 02:26
Well, you know, I'm a little biased because I am an engineer, and over a few decades I made that journey, but I'm thoroughly convinced that some of the traditional core traits of technical types are absolutely perfect for making great leaders. For example, not to over generalize engineers, but they're organized and methodical thinkers. They don't shoot from the hip, like a lot of leaders are proud of. They're very sequential in their thinking. They're inquisitive in nature. The art of sincere inquisitiveness is, I believe, a priceless characteristic in the progressive leader. It crushes stagnation when you keep asking "why." They're apolitical — and I don't mean that in the CNN versus Fox News sense, but they have uncommon objectivity. They have their keen self awareness. They're unselfish and make practical decisions versus biased decisions, in general. They're resourceful. They're detailed problem solvers. And by the way, they view the problem as the task at hand versus an interruption to the task at hand, so they're more than capable of dealing with unplanned challenges. And finally, present company excepted, they're nice people. In general, they're usually not psychopathic narcissists and completely devoid of human emotion. They're, they tend to skew on the likable side. My only caution there is that as, as they should, when engineers evolve into leadership over time, some of that niceness and apolitical characteristics have to go away, just in the interest of survival.
David Maloney, Editorial Director, DC Velocity 03:57
Sure. Well, those are all very interesting traits and kind of looking at those, what traits and skills are often lacking in those groups that are needed to become a good manager.
Mike Kotecki, Consultant, MK Tactical Leadership 04:08
There's more than a few. I think I'm upwards of 30 in the book that I put together, but the two areas that I personally struggle with, number one was little business acumen. Although as technically brightest STEM people are, their education and their career training often have very little content for the business and financial side of things, basics like understanding a P&L statement, a balance sheet, doing business planning are lacking. The good news is, you can learn those things. If you're a good listener, parentheses, like engineers are, you can pick those up with night school, with reading. Those are tactical, learned skills. The other is a little stickier, and that's the people side of things. I mean, most of us who took those personality tests in high school to help direct our next education or career moves didn't send us to be a standup comic or a senator, right? I mean, the folks in technology were destined for technology, and maybe there are people skills lacking as part of that. Don't know if you knew it, for example, but Herbert Hoover was the only president that was an engineer, and that was probably because he was a crummy engineer, so they're not necessarily known for being the person who fills the room or can can guide others. However, my answer to that would be finding good mentors. That's a skill you don't necessarily pick up by reading a book or going to a night school, but find someone above you in the org chart, ideally, that has those skills and understands your strengths and weaknesses and can put their arm around you to guide you in developing your interpersonal characteristics.
David Maloney, Editorial Director, DC Velocity 05:55
And those are all interesting traits there, but, Mike, what are some of the reasons why you think that some engineers have difficulty being selected for management positions? Are they just pigeonholed as always being engineers?
Mike Kotecki, Consultant, MK Tactical Leadership 06:08
Well, you hit it on the head there, pal. You know, sadly, you're right about that. When looking for the next top executive, a lot of leaders often cruise the sales office or the finance office hunting for MBAs with a good, strong handshake and a smile on their face. But some of the things that are keeping engineers from being plucked into leadership training or leadership roles are, frankly, as you indicated, the biases. They're viewed as awkward, smart nerds who work best in dark places. Typically, there's low visibility, and when you're five to 10 levels down in the org chart from the boardroom, not many people know your name, or if they try to say it, they get it wrong. Akin to that, low self promotion. When engineers are task-driven and humble folks that don't spend a lot of time posting selfies of themselves in the robotics lab, those people don't get recognized, they don't get noticed because they don't promote themselves, and that's okay. That's a sign of humility, and that will come in handy later. And lastly — and this one's a tough one to argue — a lot of times they're valuable as is. If Mary is on the brink of finding a cure to cancer in biomedical engineering, they're probably not going to ask her to become a leader. They're gonna say, "Okay, well, Mary, keep up the good work and look forward to seeing what your results are."
David Maloney, Editorial Director, DC Velocity 07:35
Right, and are there other certain experiences that engineers should employ to start their journey into leadership?
Mike Kotecki, Consultant, MK Tactical Leadership 07:42
Absolutely. You know, I think the first thing is to test your own interests or aptitude, or if you have the raw material personally to to make that journey, but mostly remember Jeff Foxworthy, you know, he had the old old schtick "You might be a redneck, if your outdoor furniture used to be your indoor furniture." You got to ask yourself, Do I find great joy in humbly helping others succeed? If so, you might be a leader. If you get a kick out of contributing to someone else's success and the overall goodness of an organization, frankly, you may have the foundation to be a great leader. And my advice to that person or people that have that Inkling is get comfortable raising your hand when opportunity knocks, or when it doesn't, when they're asking for volunteers to work on a special project, when they're looking for someone to undertake something outside of the engineering role, or there's an opportunity to, whether it's a trade show or a speaking engagement or a special M&A project, raise your hand, and let people know that you're a good volunteer. Similarly, share your aspirations with those above you, whether it's your annual review, or your one-on-ones with your with your leadership team, let them know, You know, I think I got an itch to lead others to greatness, and I'd like to explore that if I could. Make sure that keeps coming up, as long as you believe as much. And next, take inventory. You know, there was a point in my career early on where I realized there's a long list of things I didn't know. I could certainly do software and strength of materials calculations, but there was a whole lot I wasn't aware of, so I started taking night classes. I started going to different universities to round out that which were the gaps in my, in my education, to make me a candidate for that leadership, and also make it a lot easier. And then lastly, and I touched on this earlier, seek a mentor or two, and do that formally. Don't just say, "Hey, boss, would you mind spending a little bit of time with me over lunch once a month," but put together a formal plan with someone who's willing to invest in you and your career path and your growth and allow them to be the mentor that helps close those gaps.
David Maloney, Editorial Director, DC Velocity 09:59
That's all very good advice. Do you have some other tips to help aspiring engineers be successful as leaders?
Mike Kotecki, Consultant, MK Tactical Leadership 10:04
Well, let me give you just a few that I learned the hard way. And one, and this is this has got to be done early on, when you start moving from being an individual contributor to the manager or leader or supervisor of other people, you need to tell yourself and be clear about it, you're no longer the technically smartest person in the room. So, you may have been the, nicknamed the brain before this, but from now on, the things that you were so proud of have to go away. Your measure of success now is not what you design and produce; it's what your team designs and produce[s]. A lot of them stub their toe. Let each of them undergo the process of transformation, but no longer be the guru. You got to kind of learn to keep your technical prowess in the drawer. My second is understanding the continuum between strategic and tactical. Leaders, particularly executive leaders, love to talk about how strategic they are. "I'm a strategic leader. I always think long term. I've got high hopes." Well, that's good, and you need that, but it's a continuum, not a toggle switch. So, understand that at some point, someone has to do something, and not just think about the future. So, be aware of that, continuing to recognize your place in it. Early on, you'll be a tactical leader, where things get done because of your team and you're goal oriented, so you can you can lead to help others complete the plan. And finally, and this is more of a personality comment than a tactical comment, and that is learn to skew optimistic. Engineers are realists in the finest sense of the word, and that's important when you're designing airbags for SUVs, you gotta be a realist. However, when your team's looking to your face to decide if they should freak or not, you're better off smiling. When things get tough, however, be — do be optimistic, but when things do get tough, you need to, above all share realism with the adults around you. Make sure that you inspire them to get through tough times, build confidence, and lead others to overcome challenges. But again, to repeat myself, when you've got an opportunity to be optimistic, that's contagious, it's powerful, and it gets things done, so, again, I would heartily advise that people skew optimistic as they get into the leadership role.
David Maloney, Editorial Director, DC Velocity 12:32
That's all very good advice. Mike, how can listeners find your book?
Mike Kotecki, Consultant, MK Tactical Leadership 12:37
I know it's a number of places, but you certainly can find it on Amazon. Leadership for Engineers: How to Turn Perfectly Good STEM Professionals Into Management. All the proceeds from that book go to the University of Wisconsin-Milwaukee, where I was granted an engineering degree. So, it's my way of, hopefully, helping others proceed and, at the same time, giving back a little bit.
David Maloney, Editorial Director, DC Velocity 13:00
That's great. And we will put a link to where you can find it on Amazon within the notes section of this podcast, if you're looking for more information. Again, our guest today has been Mike Kotecki, and the book is Leadership for Engineers: How to Turn Perfectly Good STEM Professionals Into Management. Mike, it's been great to catch up with you. Thank you for taking your time to join us today on Logistics Matters.
Mike Kotecki, Consultant, MK Tactical Leadership 13:23
Great. Thanks for the opportunity.
David Maloney, Editorial Director, DC Velocity 13:25
Now let's take a look at some of the other supply chain news from the week. And Victoria, you wrote this week about how the move to digital technologies is now spreading from the four walls of a distribution center to outside the facility. What can you tell us?
Victoria Kickham, Senior Editor, DC Velocity 13:40
Yes, Dave that's right. So, the digitalization of the supply chain continues, and this week we saw some evidence that points to the warehouse or distribution center yard as the next place where major changes may occur. Technology research company ABI Research released a report showing that the adoption of artificial intelligence- or AI-enabled cameras and autonomous yard trucks — those are the vehicles that move trailers around yards and distribution centers — is set to grow quite a bit between now and 2030 — so, six, seven years from now. Use of autonomous yard trucks, which is still in the very early stages of development, is set to grow at a compound annual growth rate of more than 50% worldwide in that time. Companies are also expected to start using more handheld devices and AI-enabled cameras in their yards, and that's to provide visibility and track movement of both assets and workers. The installed base of AI-enabled cameras, for example, is expected to reach 11.2 million globally by 2030, according to this report,
David Maloney, Editorial Director, DC Velocity 14:46
Victoria, what's driving those trends?
Victoria Kickham, Senior Editor, DC Velocity 14:49
Well, a couple of things. First, many companies have been working to digitalize operations inside the warehouse, as you mentioned earlier, and on the road, in their trucks and fleets. We've reported quite frequently on Logistics Matters and in our magazine pages about the increased adoption of warehouse automation technology, as well as the use of smart devices and other technologies in the cabs of trucks, for instance. So, now it seems like companies want to continue those advances by taking the tech outdoors. And it's getting easier to do that, especially as technology advances and can break down some of the limitations that are often faced in outdoor environments. As just one simple example, today's advanced computing power can process data from cameras more quickly and can also help guide autonomous vehicles more safely. Another factor driving all this is that supply chain technology providers themselves are increasingly focused on bringing these smart solutions to the yard. Many established supply chain tech companies are starting to diversify into yard-management systems, for example. Those are the IT systems that monitor and manage the movement of equipment in the yard. And there are also new entrance — entrants, excuse me — to this slice of the supply chain tech market. So, there's a lot going on. It's interesting to watch all of this unfold, of course, and we'll continue to keep an eye on it.
David Maloney, Editorial Director, DC Velocity 16:08
We certainly will. Thank you, Victoria.
Victoria Kickham, Senior Editor, DC Velocity 16:11
You're welcome.
David Maloney, Editorial Director, DC Velocity 16:13
And Ben, hardly a day goes by when we don't hear talk about the potential of electric cars and trucks, but you wrote this week about some of the hurdles that may lie ahead in rapidly adopting electric vehicles. Can you share some of what you learned?
Ben Ames, Senior News Editor, DC Velocity 16:28
Yeah, glad to. As you say, this is a very common topic, and transportation in particular has an important role to play. That's the motivation. Some of the headline stuff that we've been covering has been ambitious plans, like California's requirements. They say that new cars and truck sales will soon have to be emission-free in future years. And as we've seen, of course, because of California's economic size and leverage, many other states often adopt those same standards. In this case, there are actually 18 other states and provinces that have adopted those California electric new-car sales. So, that's the pattern that had led the analyst firm ACT Research to say this week that half of all commercial vehicles sold in the U.S. will be zero-emission vehicles by 2040. So, that's just 17 years away. In those few years, that change initially is going to be pushed by that regulation that we mentioned. But then, in the second half of those 17, it'll happen more organically, because technology upgrades, ACT Research says, like improved battery design and better charging infrastructure, it'll just make it cheaper to own EVs anyway, than gas-burning cars. And to be clear, what ACT is talking about here when they say "commercial vehicles," it's a pretty wide range of stuff. They're talking from Class 4 all the way up to Class 8, so that moves from things like step vans, low cab forward, RVs, school buses, all the way up to straight trucks — day cabs, and sleeper cabs.
David Maloney, Editorial Director, DC Velocity 18:05
Well, that all sounds like good progress, but still, if you say that half will be electric, won't the other half of vehicles need to also run on conventional fuels to keep our supply chains moving?
Ben Ames, Senior News Editor, DC Velocity 18:17
Exactly. So, you noticed that, huh? What the forecast is talking about is new vehicle sales. So, of course, you know, the other half of the vehicles, even if it's half electric by 2040, there'll still be new vehicles being sold that'll be gas or diesel then — not to mention all the other cars and trucks that are still running. So, in this case, you know, we saw another study this week from a think tank called The Conference Board, and they said that those new EVs will constitute just a fraction of the total cars on the road for decades to come. The reason there is that drivers tend to hold onto cars that they own and that keep on working — those gas-burning cars — for an average of 12 years. So, even if the share of EVs sold in the U.S. rises — you know, in 2022 it was just 6% of new cars — in The Conference Board's figuring, even if it hits 100% by 2040, then almost half of all cars and the trucks on the road that year would still be fossil-fuel-powered. So, you know, as — I apologize for all the numbers, but it just shows, you know, with the speed of this change, in The Conference Board's view, businesses are going to have to be prepared to manage their operations in what they call a "bifurcated," or a split market. So that's, you know, the challenge there is going to be declining returns from investments in fossil-fuel infrastructure as that sector shrinks. Another factor is going to be the decline of gasoline and diesel sales revenue that's generated, because a lot of the money that keeps our roads paved and highways running comes from that, you know, gasoline fuel tax right now. Then finally, there's actually a third study I read — like you indicated, there's a lot of talk about this nowadays. This one's from National Grid and Hitachi Energy, and they pointed out that another hurdle is going to be providing the extra electricity to charge all those new EVs. So, you know, the electric folks are going to have to upgrade the grid to power all those medium- and heavy-duty vehicles, and that's going to take a real group effort. National Grid, of course, they're a utility themselves, but they mentioned, you know, they have to include utilities and the regulators and the businesses and the communities, so, you know, this is something with both of those hurdles, and with just adapting to them that's going to really touch all of us in these coming few decades.
David Maloney, Editorial Director, DC Velocity 20:50
Yeah, indeed, it does seem like a lot has to happen to really prepare for an all-electric future. It may take a while.
Ben Ames, Senior News Editor, DC Velocity 20:57
Sure is. Yep.
David Maloney, Editorial Director, DC Velocity 20:58
Thanks, Ben. We encourage listeners to go to DCVelocity.com for more on these and other supply chain stories. And also check out the podcast Notes section for some direct links on the topics that we discussed today.
And again, we'd like to thank Mike Kotecki for being our guest. We welcome your comments on this topic and our other stories. You can email us a podcast@dcvelocity.com.
We also encourage you to subscribe to Logistics Matters at your favorite podcast platform. Our new episodes are uploaded on Fridays.
Speaking of subscribing, check out our sister podcast series Supply Chain in the Fast Lane. It's coproduced by the Council of Supply Chain Management Professionals and Supply Chain Quarterly. Check out Supply Chain in the Fast Lane wherever you get your podcasts.
And a reminder that Logistics Matters is sponsored by PERC, the Propane Education and Research Council. Propane is the safe, reliable energy for material handling. Propane-powered forklifts can improve air quality inside your facilities for a healthier, more productive workforce. See how propane can give your productivity a boost at propane.com/forklifts.
We'll be back again next week with another edition of Logistics Matters. Be sure to join us. Until then, have a great week.
Articles and resources mentioned in this episode:
- Amazon: Leadership for Engineers: How to Turn Perfectly Good STEM Professionals into Management
- Warehouse yards to go digital
- Study predicts bifurcated market as EVs replace gas-burning cars and trucks
- Visit Supply Chain Quarterly
- Listen to CSCMP and Supply Chain Quarterly's Supply Chain in the Fast Lane podcast
- Listen to Supply Chain Quarterly's Top 10 Supply Chain Threats podcast
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